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Post by ModM on Feb 5, 2015 18:05:42 GMT 12
So here goes. Let me just start by saying that this is no way to be considered as immigration advise. And that the points presented below are opinions of a person who has worked in the industry for a long time - 15 years. I hope below is a good summary of our 30 minutes interview.
1. You will not have a problem about the quality of education of state schools and some prominent private schools e.g. University of Auckland, Unitec, AUT, Massey University, Manukau Inst of Technology. The costs for studying (international students) at these schools however are much higher than the rates offered by tertiary institutes and schools.
2. Education agents get hefty commissions from schools. The average rate is 20% of the tuition fees but it is not surprising that some of the schools will provide more than 20% - even 30% or higher especially those that offer low tuition fees to attract more agents to work for them and send them students.
3. Competition for these schools to attract students is high. Hence a number offering lower tuition rates than others.
4. Some of these schools are there not for the academic/quality of education bit but work for the numbers and are targeting what is called immigration markets - these immigration markets are China, India, Philippines etc. These are countries where a large number of people and students want to study in New Zealand not primarily for advancing education but as a pathway to get into New Zealand. In short, taking the student visa route as a pathway for immigration.
Some of these schools then are focusing on getting costs down and deliver the cheapest and fastest way to immigration points.
5. In theory, the bodies who are supposed to look at the quality of these schools and to regulate/monitor are shared - INZ, NZQA and ENZ (Education New Zealand). These bodies however seem to not be good at regulating the industry and there are gaps. Some schools sometimes wonder how some schools get good ratings and does not reflect the feedback as well as the quality of the students they produce.
6. The possible explanation is that the students do not provide objective and honest feedback because they are afraid to give them in fear of authority or because they are afraid of "fighting" authorities that could hurt their immigration potential.
7. Note that Education New Zealand is the body tasked by the government to "promote New Zealand as an international study destination". You will not of course, find in their website any negative feedbacks about the schools or the system because it is counterintuitive to their mandate of promoting and marketing.
8. Not all the schools follow the same business model of just keeping the costs low to attract more students. Some schools find that they prefer attracting good quality students rather than up their numbers. In the end, they only get smaller income from keeping costs low.
9. The best feedback is from students who have graduated from the schools.
10. A recommendation is to find a school that does not have a dominance of one or two nationalities.
11. Some schools like his previous school did not specifically target the Philippines because Filipinos tend to go for low cost. They have had only very very few Filipino students in the past. Many of the good schools do not consider Philippines as a target market =(
12. The government assess schools and categorizes schools as Category 1, 2 etc (1 being the highest). Within schools and tertiary institutes however, they feel sometimes it is not reflective of the quality of the education. Note also that the categorization changes depending on assessment years.
13. These are his opinions about the following schools
NTEC - has not heard a good thing about this school
Cornell - mixed feedback - both good and bad
EDENC? EDENZ - mixed - there was an immigration problem before but I think this has been sorted
NIES - he has not heard of this school
AIS - probably okay. Seems an okay school.
Note: I have not included the school he previously worked with to avoid any bias.
lastly, I have been offered to be introduced to other practitioners (over 25 years) to ask more information and discuss the issues if I am keen. I didn't take the offer because I feel that this is comprehensive enough and I feel that in the end, while school choice is a factor, it will be the student who is in charge of his life and path.
I hope those who are planning to take the student route will plan carefully considering that they will be spending a lot of money.
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Post by zia on Feb 6, 2015 0:11:58 GMT 12
Well said Ms ModM. Thank you for the insights and useful info you shared. Sadly, that is the bitter reality that all students here must face. If everyone will be honest, most of us here will agree that taking the student path is really like buying an "expensive" ticket to set foot to NZ, you might not get a first-class ticket (a worthwhile education), but you'll get to your destination just the same (permanent residency/NZ citizenship). It's quite disheartening that a lot of the educational institutions (big or small ones) are on the bandwagon and taking advantage of the situation and our dreams. The enormous fees charged to international students are beyond shocking, but it's like that everywhere - in OZ, UK, even here in SG. It's not any different from a hefty payment in exchange for achieving your citizenship aspirations, and the government and schools are well into it. As a "would be midlife-aged student" (I feel old just typing that), finding the right balance between investing highly on the school I want to get into, having high hopes that I can benefit and get the most from that huge investment and being prepared to accept whatever outcome that investment may produce, is what I really need to put in the right perspective. Personally, I am at my wit's end, I desperately want to get to NZ for the sake of a better future for my family, I want to get into a good school and get something good from what I invested, but at the same time, I don't want to end up with zero balance on my bank account. We all just have to hope for the best I guess. This is why I truly appreciate people in this forum who are so transparent and honest in sharing their experiences with others... whether good or bad. Sugar-coating and not presenting the whole truth will only hurt the chances of those who are seeking for real answers/feedback. I'm glad I stumbled upon this forum, and I commit to you all that when I get to NZ, I will not forget this forum and will try my best to pay it forward to those in need of guidance/advice/tips when the table gets turned. (Sorry, dito na ako nag-practice ng essay ko... malapit na kse akong mag-take ng IELTS eh... hahaha!) |
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Post by doppleganger21 on Feb 6, 2015 4:12:35 GMT 12
Just got an email from AIS and the Student Marketing Manager said they DO NOT ACCEPT Certificate of ENglish as Medium of Instruction as an alternative to the requirement of English Proficiency. They require IELTS in academic with overall 6.0 (no band below than 5.5)
Anyway, here's a list of discounts we can avail from them:
Level 8 = from NZ$21,300 to NZ$15,895
Level 7 = from NZ$19,000 to NZ$15,119
You can check their website for the breakdown of costs!
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Post by ModM on Feb 6, 2015 20:03:35 GMT 12
zia the best way for us to help others is to share experiences and knowledge. It is up to readers to use them to better plan their paths and strategize well so they do not waste hard earned resources (and maybe even borrowed, in some cases). doppleganger21 although a strict implementation on the IELTS requirements mean additional expenses, I think it is one way for AIS to ensure that their students are proficient in English and are able to maximize the learning opportunity at that school. Good on AIS for doing that!
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Post by nikats on Feb 6, 2015 21:00:16 GMT 12
Oh no. I'm enrolled at NTEC business 7. Welp. Do the most I can do, is all I can say now. Ika nga, nasubo na. How i wish I'd seen this site a few months ago tho, so I could have been better informed.
So now my question is, do you guys think it'll be a mark against us with future employers that we came from these schools, ie ntec etc? I know depende pa din siguro, but I'd like to hear your opinions on this.
Balak pa naman sumunod na kapatid ko next year, but at least I'll be there to guide him on which schools he can enter.
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Post by nekou on Feb 6, 2015 21:17:59 GMT 12
Hi nikats, tingin ko hindi naman, lalo na meron din naman tayong baon na solid na credentials (I hope!) na galing either sa work experience or educational background sa Pinas. And gaya nga ng lagi nilang sinasabi, mas nag-m-matter dito ang Kiwi work experience pagdating sa employers. |
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Post by nikats on Feb 6, 2015 21:27:12 GMT 12
Hello nekou I'm hoping they will recognize yung educ background and konting work experience sa Pinas. Hopefully I find a part time work who will take a chance on me. Minsan lang pag napapaisip ako, nakaka overwhelm din, kasi it's like you're starting from scratch, lalo na wala akong kilala pa talaga sa nz. Which is why I'm very thankful I stumbled upon this site. Such a godsend. |
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Post by nekou on Feb 6, 2015 21:52:24 GMT 12
Yup, meeedyo mahirap nga yung mag-start from scratch talaga kung iisipin mo, pero you can look at it this way also: NAKAKA-EXCITE sya. Kumbaga sa videogames, RESET button. Bagong chance sa buhay ;-)
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Post by zia on Feb 7, 2015 0:04:01 GMT 12
Hi nekou Sobrang like at feel na feel ko yung sinabi mo. Sobrang exciting talaga ang journey na ito! |
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Post by doppleganger21 on Feb 7, 2015 4:38:35 GMT 12
ModM, i think its commendable as they follow this strictly. It may not play out well for others who want entry w/o taking the IELTS but it just goes to show how the schools stays competitive globally. Too bad I don't have that much luxury to get an IELTS, if there are other schools who can admit me without sweat lol! Nevertheless, their tuition fee is A-Ok!
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Post by aBiSh @admin on Feb 9, 2015 9:57:54 GMT 12
Yey! Thank you sis ModM for the very comprehensive feedback from your friend. Sobrang laking tulong nito. zia for sure pasok na pasok ka na sa IELTS niyan. Ang galing ng practice mo! Haha.. nikats and nekou I think it's also to your advantage now that you've heard about their feedback. Kapag nag-start na classes ninyo maybe you can do little changes on their system. Also, magiging malaking factor yung educational background and work experience ninyo sa Pinas kung mag-uumpisa pa lang kayong mag-job hunt dito. Palagay ko ang dapat makaalam ng ganitong feedback ay NZQA. Tama yung sinabi ng friend mo sis ModM na yung ibang students siguro hindi nakakapagbigay ng objective na survey dahil natatakot. O baka naman hindi talaga nakakarating sa regulating bodies yung opinion ng mga students. Maybe there's still something we can do. |
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Post by blueblush on Feb 9, 2015 16:31:05 GMT 12
Hi! Newbie here =). Kabilang din po ako sa mga nagnanais na makapag-aral sa NZ. May nakita akong website www.study2work.co.nz, at pinay ang independent educ agent - Si. Ms Yolanda Alba. Free lang daw services nya (bakit kaya ganun?).May nakapat try na ba sa inyo dito sa mga services nya? |
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Post by zia on Feb 9, 2015 17:45:42 GMT 12
Hi blueblush Yung alam kong member ng forum na nakapag-try ng services nya ay si felipe. I also emailed Ms Yolly to inquire, mag-skype sana kami, pero di na ako tumuloy kse I realized na doable naman ang pag-process ng student visa at mabilis naman sumagot ang mga schools. So parang di na rin need ng educ agent.Kaya libre services nya kse school ang magbabayad sa kanya ng commission. |
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Post by blueblush on Feb 9, 2015 19:36:45 GMT 12
Hi blueblush Yung alam kong member ng forum na nakapag-try ng services nya ay si felipe. I also emailed her to inquire, mag-skype sana kami, pero di na ako tumuloy kse I realized na doable naman ang pag-process ng student visa at mabilis naman sumagot ang mga schools. So parang di na rin need ng educ agent.Kaya libre services nya kse school ang magbabayad sa kanya ng commission. Hi mariz22. Nabasa ko din about kay felipe. Nakapag usap na kami ni Ms Yolly a week ago. Sabi niya she can also help in looking for scholarships. funding, etc. Nakwento ko kasi sa kanya na may conditional offer (postgrad diploma in applied science) na ako dati pero di ako natuloy due to financial probs at very competitve naman scholarships. Di rin ako magqqualify sa NZAID kc di naman kagandahan grades ko =(. |
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Post by zia on Feb 9, 2015 19:46:27 GMT 12
blueblush I see. I suggest that when you inquire sa school, derechohin mo sila in asking about discount or scholarships available. Sa AIS, I asked for discount, and nagbigay naman. PGDip din kukunin ko dun, from 21K naging 16K. Di ako sure kung may bearing ba sa discount kapag nag-agent ka, kse baka dahil magbabayad na sila sa agent, di na magbigay sa iyo ng discount (di ako sure jan, theory ko lang yan, you have to further inquire on this). Anong course kunin mo and saang school? May mga schools din na ang gusto sa authorised agent ka dumaan, like Unitec. Mabait ba kausap si Ms Yolly? Ang personal concern ko kse kpag agent, baka mas matagal ang process kse may middleman pa... opinyon ko lang nman yan.
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Post by ModM on Feb 9, 2015 21:33:30 GMT 12
I may be wrong but the 21k to 16k as example lang is roughly 25% discount. Yan din siguro ang amountbthey give as agent commission. Tama nga na nasa average na 20% and even more ang commission na pwede ibigay sa agents.
If you translate that in pesos ang laki na nyan. 5K NZD is roughly 150k pesos. Madaming tao na pwede ipasweldo nyan lalo sa province.
Sent from my GT-I9505 using proboards
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Post by blueblush on Feb 9, 2015 23:28:10 GMT 12
blueblush I see. I suggest that when you inquire sa school, derechohin mo sila in asking about discount or scholarships available. Sa AIS, I asked for discount, and nagbigay naman. PGDip din kukunin ko dun, from 21K naging 16K. Di ako sure kung may bearing ba sa discount kapag nag-agent ka, kse baka dahil magbabayad na sila sa agent, di na magbigay sa iyo ng discount (di ako sure jan, theory ko lang yan, you have to further inquire on this). Anong course kunin mo and saang school? May mga schools din na ang gusto sa authorised agent ka dumaan, like Unitec. Mabait ba kausap si Ms Yolly? Ang personal concern ko kse kpag agent, baka mas matagal ang process kse may middleman pa... opinyon ko lang nman yan. Pwede palang magtanong ng ganun regarding discounts? Thanks sa tip mo ha! =) Sana pwede yun sa Lincoln University (Christchurch). PGDipAppSci in Seed Technology ang inaaplyan ko ngayon. Actually, natanggap na ako sa programme na to noong year 2011 pero conditional offer pa nga lang kasi di pa bayad ang tuition (na aabot sa PhP 700K+) at wala pang IELTS. Hanggang nag lapse siya. Kaya ngayon try ko ulit mag apply upon the advice of Ms Yolly. Mabait naman siya, nag tatagalog pa rin kahit 30 years na siya sa NZ. Nag email ako sa kanya kung anong mga polytechs ang maganda at may high chance of employment after. Mas mura kasi fees sa polytechs compared sa univs (UoA, Massey, Lincoln, etc) at may 6 months courses sa polytechs (so kokonti magagastos). Pero advice pa rin niya sa akin ituloy ko ang Lincoln kaysa sa polytechs. Nag iinsist ako dahil sa mahal ng tuition. At sinabi ko rin na hindi naman kagandahan mga grades ko kaya hirap makapasok sa NZAID scholarship, kaya ayoko na din mag attempt na mag apply =). Pero sabi nya she can help daw to look for funding/scholarships. Makakatulong din daw siyang mahanapan ka ng part time job (20hrs). Siguro sa tagal na nya sa NZ marami na siyang contact na employers. Kaya na encourage akong mag apply ulit ng PGDip. |
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Post by blueblush on Feb 9, 2015 23:38:07 GMT 12
I may be wrong but the 21k to 16k as example lang is roughly 25% discount. Yan din siguro ang amountbthey give as agent commission. Tama nga na nasa average na 20% and even more ang commission na pwede ibigay sa agents. If you translate that in pesos ang laki na nyan. 5K NZD is roughly 150k pesos. Madaming tao na pwede ipasweldo nyan lalo sa province. Sent from my GT-I9505 using proboards Hi mayagx. Siguro noh yun na ang napupunta sa agents. Bakit kaya uso ang educ agents jan NZ at OZ =) |
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Post by zia on Feb 10, 2015 0:49:05 GMT 12
zia for sure pasok na pasok ka na sa IELTS niyan. Ang galing ng practice mo! Haha.. Ma'am, sana po mag-dilang anggel kayo... nakasalalay kasi ang Offer of Place ko jan... OOP daw w/English condition kasi maibigay sa akin ng AIS, kapag pumasa me... tuloy tuloy na (praying hard!). Salamat po. ModM Sobrang pumalakpak nga po ang tenga ko nung nagbigay sila ng discount, ang sabi nila discount daw po yun for Pinoy students. Ang hindi ko naitanong is kung same din ba ang discount kung dadaan through agent. Derecho kse akong nakikipag-coordinate sa kanila. blueblush Wow! Ang ganda naman ng course mo, highly specialized, ganda yan. Oo, very straightforward na ang tanong ko at straightforward din naman sila sumagot. So far ang napagtanungan ko na NO DISCOUNT daw: CPIT, Whitirea, UUNZ. Sa IPC (Pamerston North), nagbibigay sila ng scholarship as big as 10K if you qualify, pero business studies lang PGDip nila. Ang mahal sa Lincoln eh, na-consider ko yan kse sila lang ang meron ng unang course na preferred ko (GradDip kse kaya limited), pero gosh! mamumulubi naman ako sa kanila kaya move on na lang sa iba na mejo kaya kong igapang ang pang-tuition... hehe! Thanks sa feedback mo kay Ms Yolly, mabilis nga sha sumagot at mukhang mabait, nag-aalangan ng lang akong dumaan pa sa agent ngayon kse baka mabawasan pa ang discount na binigay ng school, kailangan linawin ko muna sa school. Pero ang ganda ng offer nya ha... kung makakatulong nga sha sa job placement. All the best sa paghanap mo ng school! By the way, pwede ka dito maghanap ng scholarships na pwede mong subukan: NZ Scholarhips. |
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Post by blueblush on Feb 10, 2015 1:53:26 GMT 12
mariz22 Maganda daw kasi ang research sa Lincoln sabi sa classmate kong nag PhD dun kaya Lincoln pinili kong applayan.
Cheaper din pati ang cost of living. Sige, try ko nga ulit magtanong nyan sa LU. Nakagaan ng pakiramdam nung nakausap ko si Ms Yolly, na may helpful suggestions siya para situation ko.
Pero gather gather pa rin ako ng mga infos sa ngayon ng funding possibilities at sa mga nakapag avail ng services ni Ms Yolly.
Re: NZ Scholarships website-- pang masters qualification naman ang pwede sa Lincoln. Bihira lang ang para sa PGDip.
Lagi ko din binibisita site na to kaso mailap ang pang PGDip para sa course ko.
Goodluck sa study plans natin! Keep us posted =)
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Post by zia on Feb 10, 2015 3:47:21 GMT 12
blueblush That's good. At the end of the day, kung ano nman ang pinaka-suitable at in alignment sa ating plans and priorities, dun tayo di ba. Tanungin ko nga din yung school ko, baka nman walang bearing sa discount eh, kontakin ko na rin si Ms Yolly ulit at baka makakatulong sha sa job placement. Naitanong mo ba sa kanya kung mandatory na managerial ang lalalandingan na trabaho kpag PGDip or MBA ang natapos na course. May nkpagsabi kse nyan sa akin pero di rin ako sure, ang intindi ko kse sa INZ Op Manual basta related field lng regardless of the position, kaya nako-confuse ako sa bagay na yan. Sana mkpagbigay din ng guidance nila sina aBiSh @admin ModM Ano ni Moose db and others na nakakaalam sa bagay na ito. Tnx po!
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Post by Ano ni Moose on Feb 10, 2015 11:28:03 GMT 12
I think it's safe to assume that the long term goal is to get residency right? In this case, it will fall under skilled migrant category. According to this link, Skilled employment is employment that requires specialist, technical or management expertise. Perhaps among the three, the least difficult to find is managerial than a specialist or technical position. My 2 cents. Ano ni Moose |
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Post by blueblush on Feb 10, 2015 13:12:25 GMT 12
zia yes correct! Kung para sa atin, para talaga sa atin =). Sorry di ko rin natanong yung about dun. Ano ni Moose Thanks sa inputs mo =)
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Post by zia on Feb 10, 2015 13:34:36 GMT 12
Ano ni Moose Thanks po for sharing your thoughts. aBiSh @admin Pasensya na po na-off topic na nga kami... pakilipat na lang po where appropriate. Thanks po.
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Post by aBiSh @admin on Feb 10, 2015 13:37:10 GMT 12
Baguhin ko na lang thread title mo zia para sama-sama na.  |
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Post by zia on Feb 10, 2015 13:45:24 GMT 12
Yey! Salamat po Ms aBiSh @admin Nake-carried away po kse minsan sa chikahan at Q&A |
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Post by terradata on Feb 10, 2015 16:38:49 GMT 12
If you value quality education and tuition fee, please don't apply in NTEC as a Software Development IT student. They don't teach well. Here's why: 1. Most lecturers just read the presentation 2. If you ask questions, they will usually answer, "Just google it" or "I will get back to you" (but it never happens) 3. Bad pronunciation (I don't know why they don't hire professionals) 4. Wrong explanation (Again, number 3) 5. No Job Placement (False advertising) This is based on my experience. Dito ko na appreciate ang Philippine Education. Believe me, kahit public school ng Pinas mas maayos magturo. Di ko lang alam sa ibang course pero sa course ko, malabong may matutunan ka. Parang nagbayad ka ng pagkamahal mahal to self study everything.  Ang maganda sa NTEC may accommodation for 2 weeks to look for a long term place and work... and also a time to familiarize the place. napapaisip naman akong bigla sa credibility ni NTEC dahil sa feedback na katulad nito.. tsk tsk tsk.. i believe it all depends pa rin sa estudyante in the end.. pero kahit naman siguro mahaba na ang work experience sa pinas ineexpect pa rin na updated at credible ang topics sa lectures... hindi kaya biro ang gastos ah.. @dionette kumusta naman ang ginagamit ninyong course materials anong year ang copyright ang books na gamit nyo? |
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Post by zia on Feb 12, 2015 22:19:19 GMT 12
Share ko lang para sa kaalaman ng mga interested sa AIS. As confirmed by the school, whether dumaan ka daw sa agent or derecho sa kanila, yung special rate/discount nila na binibigay sa Pinoy students ay the same lang, walang bawas ang discount.
So if you feel na makakatulong sa inyo ang agent in your student path or sa processing sa AIS, no bearing naman sha sa fees so ok lang, school din naman magbayad pati sa agent.
(Sa case ko, it's a bit too late so I decided na dumerecho na lang kse na-submit ko na rin naman lahat ng requirements sa school so wala ng gagawin actually si agent).
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Post by nikats on Feb 27, 2015 0:24:00 GMT 12
Hi sorry it's me again. But I just checked my email and I received another marketing email from IDP, another international education provider (or whatever they're called hehe): Get Your Questions Answered! Attend IDP Philippines’ Australia & New Zealand Education Exhibition 2015! Meet representatives from Australian and New Zealand institutions to know your eligibility, apply on the spot and enjoy waived application fees from most institutions. MANILA DATE: April 25, 2015, Saturday VENUE: Makati Shangri-La Hotel Ayala Avenue corner Makati Avenue, Makati City, Philippines TIME: 11AM – 5PM CEBU CITY DATE: April 26, 2015, Sunday VENUE: Radisson Blu Hotel Cebu Sergio Osmena Blvd cor Juan Luna Ave, Cebu City, Philippines TIME: 11AM – 5PM DAVAO DATE: April 28, 2015, Tuesday VENUE: Marco Polo Hotel Davao C.M. Recto Street, Davao City, Philippines TIME: 2PM – 8PM Not yet registered? Log in to www.philippines.idp.com/anz2015AGAIN I would like to say I'm not an employee of any of the educ agencies po or educ counsellors nor do I receive any remuneration from them BUT libre naman po kasi pumunta at mag register sa fairs nila (both fortrust and idp). Kung malapit po sa area nyo, I would recommend you drop by. Kasi usually may mga representatives po from the schools na andun and you can ask yung mga tao dun kung ano yung steps na mga gagawin. Kuha po kayo ng mga flyers nila dun, attend the free seminars para maliwanagan po kayo. Tapos sibat na after hehe. Punta kayo para masagot questions nyo. Kumbaga, take the opportunity na binibigay nila para makausap nyo yung representatives from the schools. Minsan directors nila andun mismo, sometimes via Skype lang. Pero importante yung mga tanong nyo po masasagot nila ng maayos. And para fair sa fortrust, I heard from my friend na meron din silang fair this weekend. Hindi ko lang sure saan, pero last year it was at Dusit hotel sa Makati. You can check their website or Facebook account ata, fortrust Manila or something. Nota bene lang po sa mga future students po natin din. Don't misunderstand po, the schools will help prepare you to look for jobs, but they will not do placements for you. Baka po kasi may mag advertise ng ganun, well and good if they do that, but prepare po tayo na most likely the schools will only point you to?  websites or tell you about postings. But they will not guarantee your employment. Be cautious po tayo, kasi hindi po birong amount ang ilalabas natin. Yun lang po, and pasensya na kung mahaba. I was just checking my emails kasi and I figured I could share this with everyone. |
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Post by aBiSh @admin on Feb 27, 2015 8:40:43 GMT 12
Thank you so much for this feedback nikats! I moved your post here para sama-sama. |
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websites or tell you about postings. But they will not guarantee your employment. Be cautious po tayo, kasi hindi po birong amount ang ilalabas natin.